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Тема: KJ Works M700 обзор

  1. #1
    Оператор Аватар для VAG
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    KJ Works M700 обзор

    Первая ласточка. К сожалению, на аглицком.
    Взято отсюда:
    http://www.airsoftretreat.com/forums/to ... C_ID=71624
    Я сделал небольшую выборку по сути:

    ====================
    The stock is similar to Tanaka except the texture is shallower and less distinct. It is as good as CA if not better. It also have a built-in inner barrel stabilizing sleeve, all these makes the rifle feels quite solid. VSR10 may have a toyish stock but I think it is a great airsoft sniper since it is a well designed, light and easy to handle spring rifle capable of holding a long inner barrel comparable to APS2-EX. Actually I think if toyish is not a problem to you and the power regulation on sniper rifle in your team is under 450fps or so,
    VSR10 may be the better choice as a game rifle.

    The KJ M700 is powerful enough for war games out of box, actually I think the stock spring is too strong, the velocity drops quickly with such a large gas flow. By replacing it with a Tanaka spring, the stability can be improved significantly, and still quite powerful.

    It has similar gas seal problem around the hop bucking as the VSR10, after this is dealt with and the spring changed properly, one may expect just minor velocity drop after emptying 1 mag in a ROF of 1 shot/per 5 sec. After all KJ copied the extraordinary Pegasus system.
    (I wonder didn't Tanaka have it patented?)

    But if you are looking for HIGH power and consistency required by a target rifle, the magazine (gas)capacity will not suffice. That's why I went to external source, since I'm not going to shoot it at living target. It's possible to convert the gun into CO2, though might not be so straight foward. You have to make your own part(the valve). And yes, antagon, I have the external source hooked up under the magazine, it's ugly and the high pressure tube is somewhat cumbersome. I'm thinking of hiding it with a Marui G3 magazine.

    Oh, and about the 300 feet practice, I'm not hitting the target all the time but I'm sure I can't blame the rifle. As for a beer can 166 feet away, it is common to make 8 hits out of 10. I've converted it into a non-hop target rifle by replacing the inner barrel and chamber with a seamless steel tube and a machined PE chamber. To make it straight, the outer barrel is also dis-connected from the stock. This rifle is now really fun to shoot... I feel all the time and money I spent on it quite worthy.
    ============================
    The stock hopup of KJ M700 is not bad...better then Tanaka I think. Tanaka hop up performs bad when using 12kg or higher pressure gas, maybe it is becuse they designed it for HFC134a. BEST GUN has been selling this for a year:
    http://img183.echo.cx/img183/1496/m700218va.jpg

    This proved to be very helpful on the consistency problem a stock Tanaka M700/M24 might have. It's main idea is a lenthenged nozzle (the grey one)that ensure bb get's placed just behind the hop up, and a tubular hop bucking meant to prevent leakage. KJ has put a long nozzle and tubular hop (marui VSR-10/ KJ Glock 26 like)in their product. Although some people are very satisfied with what they got out of box, in my case it's the inner barrel that sucks but not the hop-up system. After I put a 520mm PDI 05 barrel in(I don't have a 650mm barrel at hand) the accuracy get's much better. Mine is one of the first lot of early production, later people are getting better rifle then I do(that is, less or no work to make it a threatening game rifle) at the same price....=_=. They said that the export lot will have better quality control, let's see how it works.
    And that's all before I converted it into an external source target rifle hoohaha....
    eh...what I was trying to say is, the hop up is better designed in conept, but don't expect too much on the out of box accuracy.

    And I think the HS precision is just a mark, it's there because CA wants to make their mimic closer to the real thing. The real HS has an aluminum bedding frame and the shell is made of laminated wooven kevlar / graphite composite material. The CA stock contains none of the features, I mean, you don't see any sign of fiber in the magazine well right? Unless HS precision also has a product line designated for airsoft exclusively, it's unlikely the stock is an HS.
    It uses AEG barrel but not AEG bucking...well,
    I think I should get some pictures up.

    The bucking is completly the same as those in KJ Glock 26,
    it survived my test with several hundred rounds .43s around 470fps.
    I never tried 134a, but I guess it would be like maybe 3xxfps. You may also cut 3 turns off the stock spring, this will make the gun shoot around 430fps.
    =======================

    I bought my KJ M700 from yahoo auction. G&G is definitely not the cheapest store here, they had a special discount on Marui AEGs last year and it's really "special" cauz selling at such a low price is just not the way they do buisiness over these years. But I think buying there will still be relatively cheaper then anywhere outside the country, as long as they have KJ M700 in stock(do they?). If you're going to visit G&G be sure not to miss their M14, unlike the notorious GR-16 it's really nice and carefully built.

    Well you may contact me for information then, I will be glad to help. But I really doubt you can clear the custom with the toy, do you have experince on this? They are quite sensitive to these things recently. You might have to get to the airport really early, to talk through the custom guy about it's just a toy, a model BB gun, not a weapon blablabla..
    ====================
    I don't know if it will be more effective or not with a tightbore on. You may compair 2 guns between their stock performance but once you put custom part in, the dominating variable becomes how you do/tune it and the results can vary a lot. Occasionaly we can see a fine-tuned APS2 with stock hop-up & barrel beats it's all-laylax tightbore counterpart. All I can tell is there's plenty of room for upgrade on KJ M700 and it's several features may help a little bit during the process. I don't have solid answer for your curiousity. Sorry about that.
    =========================
    My out of box grouping is really bad(120mm x 60mm) cauz my inner barrel is bent...-_-

    And the 12kg gas(is that the gree gas in your word?) gives 178, 176, 178, 173, 165, 171, 163, 169, 165, 161(in meter per second), for 10 rounds fired in 5 seconds between each other. Ambient temperature was around 25 celsius. The average is somewhere around 550fps. You can see the velocity varies a lot and decays pretty fast. This is because the stock hammer spring is 1.too strong 2.too long to a level that it buckled(bent like a snake in the bolt). This make the gun shoot really hard at the first but the rate it consumes gas brings large temperature drop in the whole system, which deteriorate the expansion efficiency of liquid gas. A buckled spring also leads to inconsistency.

    After switching the 520mm PDI barrel in(extra barrel spacer needed for such a short barrel), cut 2.5 turns off the stock spring, the grouping got much better, though muzzle velocity dropped quite a lot. I don't have the exact measurement but I zeroed the rifle at 40 meter, managed to score sevral distant headshots in games. The rifle is chronoed 450fps in this setup and I used .29 SGM and .30 marushin BB's on it. Stable, but windage resistance is bad compared to those .36 / .43s.

    As for the external CO2 setup, I'm too shy to tell the exact number but it dwarfed everything I ever had that fires 6mm BB....

    This, and the barrel problem was widely seen in the first batch that hit the market 3~4 months ago, some people have 10 meter grouping as big as a beer can(like me...=_=) and some lucky guys shoot beer cans 25 meters away with their rifle out of box. These have been complained in our forums in Taiwan, KJ responded by promising to make some improvement in future productions. Now there are dealers selling KJ M700 at a higher price claiming what they have is "late production". You people are supposed to get this new batch but I really don't know how it will perform, since I don't have access to one of them.

    What I have done to the rifle before CO2 is:
    1.tightbore bbl and spacer
    2.disconnect the outer barrel and the stock(float)
    3.hammer spring
    4.hop-up gas seal
    5.trimming the magzine lip to make the action smoother

    only 1 costs extra money, and if your barrel is not bent a lot, 2 alone(by unscrewing the bipod screw, or removing a part inside if you want to keep the bipod screw) will help a lot. I saw people got 50mm CEP at 10 meter just by that.
    450fps is with .2s and the stock barrel length...it's 638mm I think. Maybe a 600mm or 650mm AEG barrel will fit. I'll put up the measurement later.

    12kg is the nominal pressure of some kind of 1000ml canned airsoft gas(is this the green gas?), the actual pressure is more like 8~10kg....it's not CO2.

    And the CO2 conversion..I don't recommend that cauz it can be dangerous if not done right. Green(?), Red(?) or other market available airsoft gas up to 2xx psi will be far more then enough for war games.
    Regards,
    vag
    "Развєлі тут талібан і троллєпостінг..."(c)Че

  2. #2
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    Вторая ласточка

    Данным изделием тайваньский производитель КЖВоркс в очередной раз грязно опустил конкурентов ниже плинтуса.

    Во-первых, из-за полностью металлической конструкции ресивера и затвора, включая спусковую скобу и крючек.

    Во-вторых, если не считать ствола 6,08 мм, винтовка полностью готова принимать участие в играх/тренировках без каких-либо доработок!

    В-третьих, цена в 300 долларофф просто затмевает ближайших конкурентофф.

    К минусам можно отнести только нестабильность стрельбы в зависимости от температуры окружающей среды.

    Короче, рекомендую всем желающим.
    http://talks.guns.ru/forummessage/74/75889.html

  3. #3
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    Еще один обзор. На WGC. Видимо плохо продается, решили пропиарить.

    http://www.wgcshop.com/WGC_Shop/revi...0td_review.htm

  4. #4
    2Dan
    Оперативно

    Этот обзор уже недели две висит, и к тому же про тейк-даун версию, которая видимо действительно продается не очень.

    2ALL

    Хотя, судя по иностранным отзывам, КЖ даже в обычных версиях 700и уже лажает достаточно....

    Странная особенность ценообразования - тейк-даун версия, которая, например в версии Танаки стоит дороже, в КЖ стоит дешевле....выводы можно сделать и самостоятельно....

  5. #5
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    Цитата Сообщение от Vince
    2Dan
    Оперативно

    Этот обзор уже недели две висит, и к тому же про тейк-даун версию, которая видимо действительно продается не очень.

    2ALL

    Хотя, судя по иностранным отзывам, КЖ даже в обычных версиях 700и уже лажает достаточно....

    Странная особенность ценообразования - тейк-даун версия, которая, например в версии Танаки стоит дороже, в КЖ стоит дешевле....выводы можно сделать и самостоятельно....
    Тейкдаун у танаки была полным отстоем. Я поимел возможность попробовать что оно такое. Не думюа, что КЖВ сделали надежней.
    У меня есть КЖВ и судя по моим исследованиям, она все же лучше, чем аналогичная Танака. При том мое мнение, что Танака в базе это разве что классный макет чтоб повесить на стенку, ни для чего большего без доработки она не годится.

  6. #6
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    Цитата Сообщение от Zukoff
    При том мое мнение, что Танака в базе это разве что классный макет чтоб повесить на стенку, ни для чего большего без доработки она не годится.
    Почему так Обоснуй, если можно в общих чертах

  7. #7
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    Цитата Сообщение от Vlad
    Цитата Сообщение от Zukoff
    При том мое мнение, что Танака в базе это разве что классный макет чтоб повесить на стенку, ни для чего большего без доработки она не годится.
    Почему так Обоснуй, если можно в общих чертах
    Личное мнение+ мнение людей на форумах.
    В танаке любой модели слишком короткий ноззл. который недоподает шар к хопапу. Хопап там самой идиоццкой конструкции, которую можно было придумать. При том, настроенный хопап выдает совершенно различные результаты при стрельбе. То стреляет нормально, то резко хопапит. Обычно люди занимаются удлинением ноззла, и пытаются что-то сделать с хопапом.Единственный на Украине человек, который реально добился успехов- Палермо. Думаю стоит его спросить Но это стоило ему явно много сил.

  8. #8

    Обзор KJW M700 (Eng)

    Обзор KJW M700 (English) с сайта Airsoftforum.com
    http://www.airsoftforum.com/board/SN...00-t26014.html

    P.S. Осторожно, большие фотоснимки.

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